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RE: Pitbull drama from /flash/

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1Report
pinky_popo at 22 Dec 2006: 05:38

Ok, so here's the deal.  What I'm about to say is *not* general knowledge.  If it were, and were accepted as fact, we wouldn't have these problems.  I'm not speaking as a citizen, but as a sociologist who believes firmly in the assumptions of social construction.  Basically what I'm trying to say is that a lot of what I'm about to say may *seem* radical, but is actually grounded in years of research.

So, first, some people made accusations of racist comments being made on the board.  This is not the case, and those who disagree need to read the original thread again.  The poster of the original thread stated known facts about an aggregate average perception of pitbull owners, then examined a previously proposed solution and countered it with their own thoughts.  There were no racist comments made, in fact, until a few posts later in a rebuttal.

Ok, so why do we think that the original comments were racist?  Actually, they could just as easily have been labeled sexist, as gender was mentioned.   This apparent disturbance is actually pretty easy to locate.  The flash was made to illustrate American pitbull fighting, and America runs on a racist, sexist, misogynistic society controlled by heterosexual white men.  Exposing that ethnocentric average perception challenges the power of those heterosexual white men, and therefore is stigmatized by that society.  This is intro-level sociology, folks.  Basically, let's open our minds for a moment and start recognizing that these realities need to be exposed and addressed in order for out society to move toward equality.

Alrighty, now on to the issue of pitbulls.  The statement that pitbulls are inherently aggressive is about as true as the generally held concept that human males are bigger and stronger than human females.  These concepts are true, but only because society makes them true.  Pitbulls *are* aggressive dogs because they are considered to be aggressive, and are therefore bred, trained, and bought for that aggression.  Human males are big and strong because society believes they are, and are therefore trained and socialized to become big and strong.

THIS DOES NOT HAVE TO BE TRUE.  If pitbulls were known for their expression and loyalty (for which they're famous in pitbull defense groups), they would be bred, trained, and bought for that expression and loyalty and would NOT be aggressive animals.  If out society shifted its focus away from sex differences, allowing both males and females to become big and strong (or not, as the individual case may be), the statement that men are bigger and stronger than women would no longer hold true.  Groups would be denoted by their skills, rather than by their genitalia and secondary sexual characteristics.  Actually, you can even think about it this way: imagine a society where females hunt and males take care of the children.  Females would be expected (by that society) to grow up to be big, strong hunters, while males would be expected to grow up to be compassionate, steady caretakers.  In that society, females *would* be larger than males, and that society would likely attribute that (again) to a biological difference, saying that females are inherently bigger and stronger than males.

Basically, almost everything we take as fact is constructed to meet the needs of those in power in our society.  You don't have to believe everything you've been taught.  Furthermore, let's stop defaming pitbulls, alright?  The original poster was actually more right than many people know--the only current solution to the pitbull fighting problem is to actually enforce the laws that have already been written.

Sorry for the crash course in sociology, but some misinformed, offensive things were said in order to skirt the real issues that were brought up in the flash and in that oh-so-controversial post.  If anybody has any counterarguments, I'm sorry that I won't be able to respond.  This is the only way I know to explain these concepts.  After all, I'm a sociologist, not an instructor!  ^_^

2Report (sage)
-Jes- at 22 Dec 2006: 05:47

Actually, a typical pitbull is by far one of the most peaceful, yet loyal dogs you can find on this planet. Dalmatians, Labradors and even Collies (and Don't get me started on Shepherds) are far more prone to violent outbursts, despite owner training to prevent such.

Go ahead, contact your local vet. They'll say the EXACT same. Heck, they'll even link you to the stupid law-proposition a politician in Canada made, and have you go through the "which of these dogs is a pit bull" test.

The REASON why the Pit Bull is considered a violent dog, is because of how badly people have treated the dog in the past and present. In fact, Pit Bulls rank extremely high on the list of most abused domesticated animals in the world, JUST because they've got a "reputation."

3Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 05:47

Aprently you completely missed to comment that started the whole thing CRASHING into the race part where everything turned sour.

Please try again.

4Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 05:50

"[o/t warning]
>>10857
Flaydramon,

It ain't the dogs' fault. But the reason for our popular misconceptions about certain dog breeds is that /bad dog owners/ get those breeds and often train them, deliberately or otherwise, to be Bad Dogs.

I hang out at a dog park near my home, quite often. I notice things. Most of the pit bulls that come to the park are a bit on the upper end of the normal aggression scale. Their owners are nice people. A few pit bulls are vicious animals that will attack any other dog that looks at them funny. These pit bulls (coincidentally?) are intact males that belong to angry, vicious /men/ of a particular ethnic group.

But what are you going to do? The proposed solutions I can think of are unfair. If we're going to say that "If your last name sounds like this, or if your skin is a particular colour, you can't buy this dog" - that doesn't sound right. Training people in how to handle and raise dogs properly doesn't seem right either - people who take gun safety courses can still shoot themselves in the foot, or shoot other people, and defensive driving courses only make you a safer driver for a short time; dog training courses aren't something I'd invest a lot of hope in. Credit checks, background checks, etc.? I don't think those are right either. You'd be shutting out perfectly good would-be dog owners.

All we can do is ask for better enforcement of existing dogfighting and animal-cruelty laws. We don't really need more of them."

Qouted by some retard named dreamer

5Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 05:56

>>4

Yup, that's the one I'm talking about. Let's see, "The proposed solutions I can think of are unfair." >>3, please just *try* to look at this for what it is.

6Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 06:02

You are either very blind to reality, very stupid, or both... you have to be not to see where he was getting at... please kill yourself.

7Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 06:02

Posting that to >>5 btw

8Report (sage)
-Jes- at 22 Dec 2006: 06:05

Please, both of you, take a chill pill. There are racial innuendos in that text, but it has merit in what it's trying to imply. As such, it doesn't promote racism in any way, nor glorifies it.

Seriously, someone's being touchy this morning...
And fer the love of FChan, don't start flaming, ok? The IntarWebz is full of enough pointless trolling as it is. ;)

9ReportFuck all of you racist Shitheads, I thought Fchan was THE place to be. Turns out even the mods are like the people in 7//chan, Fchan mods are racist biggots who ban people from there chat IRC. FUCK YOU NOBODY YOU RACIST RETARD. I hope you get hit by a truck.

I wasn't expecting much diffrent i guess, being as most the mods are live in GERMANY which is the NAZI CAPITAL OF THE WORLD. SorRy i don't have blond hair and blue eyes you NaZI FAGGOTS. 

(USER WAS -BANNED FOR THIS POST)
at 22 Dec 2006: 07:11

10Report(capped)
Xenofur at 22 Dec 2006: 07:17

you sat on irc spamming "fuck you". everyone would have banned you in that situation, deal with it.

oh, and for the record: i'm the only german here. =)

11Report(capped)
Gravecat at 22 Dec 2006: 07:21

>>9 Wow, we've got all the brains in the world right here, haven't we? It's simple cause and effect, really, something you probably didn't learn about in school: If you sit there spamming "fuck you" for 10 minutes straight, you get banned.

Now, go home and come back in about ten years when you finally reach maturity, mmkay? :)

12Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 07:25

>>10

Your insane! I asked for reason to the events that transpired this morning and what was your response? "Nobody cares" THATS when i started spaming you retarded ignoramous. Tell the whole fucking story or shut the hell up.

Oh wait... nazis don't tell the whole truth to ANYTHING, nevermind your just being yourself. Get the fuck back to that failed god of yours {Shitler was it?} and suck his cock.

Big smile! Biiig smile! Big SMILE!

13Report(capped)
Xenofur at 22 Dec 2006: 07:28

you did not ask anything. :)

let me quote you:

06-12-22@13:49:26 ºº¹º Join» (metrodyne) (metrodyne@aca2b303.ipt.aol.com)
06-12-22@13:50:34 (metrodyne) Fuck you nobody, You erase my post, but not the one who started the whole thing? You faggot bitch.
06-12-22@13:51:22 (metrodyne) And THAN you go and ban me, for speaking truth! What the fuck is that all about? FUCK YOU.
06-12-22@13:51:49 (metrodyne) FUCK YOU
[...]*12
06-12-22@13:52:10 (metrodyne) FUCK YOU
06-12-22@13:52:10 (Goldielocks) no one cares.
06-12-22@13:52:14 (metrodyne) FUCK YOU
[...]*8
06-12-22@13:52:26 (metrodyne) FUCK YOU
06-12-22@13:53:24 (metrodyne) Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you uck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you uck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck
06-12-22@13:53:26 (metrodyne) Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you uck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you uck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you Fuck you fuck you fuck
[ad infinitum]

also note how the only person who answered you was a simple user and not in any capacity a moderator or anything similar.

14Report (sage)
-Jes- at 22 Dec 2006: 07:29

>>10 And sure looks like he got what he deserved...

Sorry Anon nooblet, but with the way your mouth is spouting senseless drivel and unfounded bullsh#t, you're just not helping your own case.

In your case, I would advise a proportional dosage of "Sit down and Shut the F#ck up." ;)

15Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 07:31

See what happens when i tell the truth? They try to shut me up and ban me. NAZI FAGGOTS You started this shit, And i'm going to finish it. Ban me all you want, Its not going to shut my mouth at all.

Don't you have some "lesser race" to be killing or somthing? I know you retards like to do that and than think your high and mighty for striping away the lives of millions of people.

NAZI FAGGOTS.

16Report(capped)
Gravecat at 22 Dec 2006: 07:35

>>15 Here, take this shovel. I figure you might need a little more help with that hole you're digging yourself into.

17Report
at 22 Dec 2006: 07:41

FUCK YOU, You won't even let me back in the IRC to confront Nobody FACE TO FACE, You lock me out and make me Talk through this stupid Discussion page so you can twist and edit everything. Like that fucking chatlog, You go ahead and have you BIG SMILE you blond haired NAZI REJECT, Somebody needs to burn you alive.

18Report(capped)
Gravecat at 22 Dec 2006: 07:43

>>17 Y'know, this whole thing was actually entertaining for a while, but now it's just getting boring. Go back to playing with your Lego bricks or something, we're tired of your antics.

19Report(capped) (sage)
Xenofur at 22 Dec 2006: 07:48

Last comment from me on this:
The log i posted was edited. I replaced 2 groups of lines with shortcuts, denoting how often the previous lines were in there and added a shortcut at the end to denote that he went on like that for quite some time.
Aside from that though, all that is in there was exactly as it was in IRC.

20Report(capped) (sage)
Xenofur at 22 Dec 2006: 07:50

Oh yes, also: I am indeed blond and people are often jealous about my hair. ^_^

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