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at 18 Jun 2008: 23:39

Am I the only one who can like furry art and yet still be disgusted by the idea of a furry fandom?

I love looking at anthro art, but the fact that fans of it pretend to be animals, wear animal costumes, have huge conventions, invent their own language, etc, completely disgusts and shames me. Am I the only one that feels this way?

2Report (sage)
at 18 Jun 2008: 23:47

>>1
Not all fans of the art do those things.  Well...  Except the conventions part, as that's a 'fandom' thing, but not all fans attend them at all or often. 

And no, you're not alone, there's actually a lot of folks who like the anthro related idea/concept/art, but feel all the trappings of the fandom, the extreme-ish behavior of various elements of the fandom, and the acceptance thereof, are completely retarded. 

But as always, it really works best if you just take from it what you like and want, and just try not to think about the rest of it at all. 

Unless you're drunk, stoned, or making fun of those parts on the internet, of course, at which point the idea of a couple of computer geeks dressed as foxes and fucking to a chorus of 'yiff!yiff!' has tremendous comic potential. 

3Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 00:39

>>1

No, you're not. Unfortunatly we are now and forever hopeless minority in the fandumb.

4Report (sage)
at 19 Jun 2008: 02:07

"I love watching Star Trek, but the fact that fans of it pretend to be Klingons, wear costumes, invent their own languge, etc., completely disgusts and shames me. Am I the only one that feels this way?"

"I love reading Science Fiction, but the fact that fans of it pretend to be fictional characters, wear costumes, invent their own languge, etc., completely disgusts and shames me. Am I the only one that feels this way?"

"I love reading Gothic Horror, but the fact that fans of it pretend to be vampires, wear weird clothing, invent their own languge, etc., completely disgusts and shames me. Am I the only one that feels this way?"

Yes, there are others that feel the same way as you do. There always are and always will be.

Not to be too harsh about this, but get over yourself.

5Report
Mr Swede at 19 Jun 2008: 12:02

>>1
"Invent their own language"
Wait, what now?

6Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 14:07

>>5
I've never heard anyone else use the terms "yiff, scritch, murr, furpile, furiend, tailhole, facepaw" or any other idiotic variation outside of the furry fandom.

7Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 16:26

>>6

That's just slang. Not really the same thing as inventing their own language.

8Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 16:45

>>7
Semantics.

9Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 16:45

>>7
If furries weren't so damned lazy they WOULD invent their own language.

10Report(capped)
FoxStar at 19 Jun 2008: 17:03

>>9 They have and it's even more of a geek filled trainwreck then Klingon.
At least Klingon has official roots of sorts. Primal is just proof that there's far too many life stylers with NO life kicking around here.

11Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 17:19

>>10
I love you.

12Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 17:43

>>10
Primal? Are you kidding? So they like...make animal sounds at each other?

13Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 17:47

>>12
Oh god, I looked it up.

"The following text in Primal says, "I can speak Primal fairly well." It is pronounced "wee lur-ma-mee wih k'lulf"."

How the FUCK is that practical as a language? It's like a tongue twister.

14Report(capped)
Hellfire at 19 Jun 2008: 19:44

>>10 "They have and it's even more of a geek filled trainwreck then Klingon."

Leave the geeks out of it and naDevvo' peghoS. D:

15Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 23:04

anthrocons: /facepalm
Primal: /FACEPALM

16Report
at 19 Jun 2008: 23:32

>>14
Trekkies = geeks
Furries = freaks

17Report (sage)
at 20 Jun 2008: 00:06

>>16
Sorry, but to the hardcore SciFi fan, Trekkies rank somewhere just below invertebrates. It's Trekkers who copped the geek title.

18Report (sage)
at 20 Jun 2008: 00:14

>>6
Oh, then you're never met a trufan, nor committed fanac other than to perhaps argue about fiawol/fijagh until you finally gafiate?

19Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 02:57

>>17

This! As someone who was a fan of Star Trek at one point, Trekkies weird me out almost as much as furries, and they did long before I found furry.

And I've (sigh) been to a furry con, and there were Klingons there, and they out-weirded the furries. :P Kind of a bummer I was with a stick-in-the-mud friend. I should have hung out with the Klingons, for they had alcohol and narcotics. :(

20Report
Samhuinn at 20 Jun 2008: 03:29

>>1
I think the more extreme members of the fandom cheesy and somewhat immature, but... who cares? It's people having harmless fun, and I respect that just for what it is.

I suppose some of the concerned feel that these people give the fandom a bad name, and perhaps it would be more 'socially acceptable' if they were more mature. I suppose this is the mentality of some, but most (not all) complaints against the fandom strike me more as self-righteousness than an actual heartfelt attempt to bring beauty and respect to it.

Life is way easier when you don't stress the little stuff and just let people be people.

... Or non-people, as it were.

21Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 04:57

>>20
Some people like to drive around shooting people with paintball guns which leads to politicians wanting to ban said paintball guns. These people don't represent the entire paintball community but they ARE part of it.

Whether you want to admit it or not the negative actions of people within the fandom DO affect the fandom as a whole.

22Report (sage)
at 20 Jun 2008: 06:18

>>21
Negative? You mean furry fans are forcibly inflicting fursuits upon people? Making them read 'Albedo'? Busting their windows with imitation wolf howling?

Yeah, I can see politicians wanting to outlaw Furry as being too weird and tracking you down because you've associated with it in the past. Really. Those bad fans are a menace to society and and lead to the moral decay of our society, destroying civilization left and right.

Of course, they'll have to get through the Anime, SciFi and Goth people first, but only after they've dealt with all the people in society that don't toe the line of Normal.

Straighten your argument out a little. Being a Furry fan, no matter how outre and weird it might seem to some, isn't quite the same thing as popping people with a marker. Just because the Cool Kids might laugh at you for liking this stuff doesn't mean Congress is planning an emergency session to deal with the problem.

23Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 07:33

>>22
OP here.

You're misinterpreting what #21 is saying. I've never met a furry that has tried to force someone to be furry. (I have met one that insists that everyone is furry on the inside, which made me want to vomit.) Rather, the extreme furries; the ones that fursuit, have furpiles at conventions, substitute the word "yiff" for "sex" in every context; are analogous to the paintballers who vandalize property. Because of that, every paintballer is going to look like a dangerous gun nut; just as every furry is going to look like a sex-crazed animal-suiting freak. It's hard when you can't share your love of anthro art because you're associated with idiots.

24Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 10:40

>>1

"I love looking at anthro art, but the fact that fans of it pretend to be animals, wear animal costumes, have huge conventions, invent their own language, etc, completely disgusts and shames me. Am I the only one that feels this way?"

First off, not everybody in the fandom does it.  Only the more extreme members.  Secondly, like others have already pointed out, this isn't exactly unique to furry fandom.  There are extremes in every fandom.  It isn't necessarily being a furry that's going to raise eyebrows; it's being in a fandom -- any fandom.

On the other hand, most of it's just an example of enthusiasm gone wild, and creativity run amok.  Maybe the problem is that you're not even in the least connected to any creativity spark, however small.  Some are really into things -- doing things, making things, etc.  And some just like to look at the pictures.

25Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 14:16

>>24
>not everybody in the fandom does it
No, but enough do to make an impact and to make anthropomorphics an illegitimate and stigmatized art form.

>not even in the least connected to any creativity spark
Please don't jump to conclusions about me without even knowing me. I consider myself a fairly creative person; I've played and still enjoy music, written stories, tried my hand at art, and have a pretty vivid imagination. None of these things make me want to pretend to be an animal, though.

26Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 17:14

>>25

I think you overstate the case in both responses.  Anthropomorphics is in no way stigmatized or illegitimized, certainly not by the fandom.  And any writer puts himself in the place of his characters when he's writing, so there is some act of pretense going on.  And neither do all creative furries think or believe that they are animals... or even pretend to be, except in the example I just gave in re to writing.  So please heed your own advice and don't jump to conclusions without really knowing the length and breadth of the fandom.

27Report
Trickster at 20 Jun 2008: 17:53

I'm an anthro artist and I think OP and everybody who agrees with him is lacking a sense of humor. I mean, common? What the hell would make you put on a gigantic bright green full-body fursuit in the middle of summer? You're either trying to have a good time, or you lost a bet.

As for conventions... Yeah, I can imagine them being weird. But, hey. Lolicon and Tentacon will be much worse, I can assure you. Conventions are mostly commercial gain anyways. Do you have any idea how much money a con racks up? Try 7 digits, (For Anthrocon, anyways...) As for the artists that go and rent tables; Hey. You draw anthro art and it just might happen to be pornographic. Oh, look! People who are interested in buying anthro art that just might happen to be pornographic! What a coincidence!

As for inventing your own language... One word: Slang. Wiki it. You'll realize; "Oh shit! People have been doing that for YEARS."

Long story short; If you don't realize that people are going to cons/dressing up like animals/"creating their own language" FOR FUN, then you must be a horrible person and I don't want to know you.

28Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 18:42

>>27
Primal is not slang, it's gibberish. Slang is at least BASED on the language of the country. I can't imagine anyone who doesn't study Primal being able to understand it.

An old person might look at a young person saying "That shit is DOPE" weirdly but if they hear them say it enough they understand 'shit' = 'object in question' and 'dope' = 'cool' = 'neat'

Talking to someone with Primal...you might as well be going GOO GOO GAH GAH BLAOFMGMTRSMR

29Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 18:50

>>26
Think outside of the fandom. What would be a friend's reaction if you showed them a comic with furries, even if it was 100% clean? What would the reactions of others around you be if you exposed your furry art stash, even if it was again 100% clean? Chances are it wouldn't be taken too well, and don't say "WELL I DONT CARE ABOUT PPLZ OPINIONS IM BETTER THAN THEM" because you're not, and you're deluded to think that that opinions of your friends don't matter to you.

>>27
>Horrible person.
Thanks, bud. I'm not saying that all people with fursonas and fursuits are terrible people and should be burned, but that these people are responsible for making anything furry relate to a weird fetish.

30Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 22:09

>>29
I think you're thinking too much "inside the fandom" yourself - Plenty of folks have seen clean furry stuff of mine and think nothing of it, because (thankfully) 90% of everyone doesn't know or care at all about the furry fandom or the fact that there's a bunch of fetish/lifestyle tards slinging shit on it's walls. 

31Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 22:43

>>27

I don't think it's a lack of sense of humor that they're lacking, but a sense of perspective.

32Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 22:55

>>27

There's much to be said for doing things for fun, but there is also much to be said for not wanting to be associated with people that, unfortunately, decide to behave like idiots to have their fun.

33Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 23:00

29>>

I'm really not too worried about my friends' reactions about my interests.  They already know, and are either somehow likewise involved (in varying degrees) or it doesn't come up and we connect through other interests.

34Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 23:11

>>1 If by furry art you mean primarily furry porn, then I can understand how, like Groucho Marx, you wouldn't care to join any club that would accept someone like yourself as a member. If you like furry art and concepts in general - what would be considered the "clean" stuff along with the arousing stuff - then you shouldn't be afraid to support that interest.

Furry is a fandom that grew out of the other organized fandoms based on comics, animation and science fiction, so it adopted the same structure. They all have huge conventions.

I can't fathom how most people find the costuming disagreeable because it looks like and is a whole lot of fun to do, like Halloween for grownups, dressing up like some cool character out of a movie or comic book. If there's anything truly freaky going on with people in furry costumes it's been going on behind closed doors that neither you or I have been behind to see. You're basing your opinions on hearsay if you haven't actually encountered the fans and costumers and conventions you bemoan.

Really, the worst aspect of this fandom is it's gossip, but that goes for any online community that encourages anonymity.

>>29 Why not? if I showed someone a copy of ALBEDO the worst thing they'd say is that it's boring, or there's no apparent reason for these characters to be drawn as animals other than that the artist had a fondness for drawing them as such.

35Report
at 20 Jun 2008: 23:25

>>34

I pretty much agree with most of that.  But on one point: what I find disagreeable about the costuming is that for the most part, it isn't.  It's about mascots and mascot suits, like you'd find at Disneyland, the ball park or Chuck E Cheese's.  I mean, that's fine and all, but it's terrifically limited.  I don't see much given to costumes or simple 'furry' applications, such as tails, ears, muzzles and leotards.  (Although, given most fans, maybe not the leotards.)

36Report (sage)
at 21 Jun 2008: 00:47

>>28
Yeah, just like Esperanto. The noble Esperantians have a long history of high literature, I'm sure.  I'm also sure the people that speak Klingonese are easily understood by the average man on the street.

At least you got the difference between idiom and language almost right.

37Report
at 21 Jun 2008: 00:54

Personally, I laugh at the so-called 'normal' people that badmouth furry. Why do they do this?. Simple. we dont fit their narrow minded idea of normal. To them, normal means working 9 to 5, paying taxes, and sitting in front of the tv with a beer in one hand and a remote in the other going click click click. What?... Furry?... preposterous. Theres no room in this world for cute. You have to watch baseball and nascar to be a real man. Yeah, whatever.

38Report (sage)
at 21 Jun 2008: 01:04

>>23
No, I understood what he was arguing- and you as well. You're insinuating, in essence, that being weird is  just as bad as performing a physical assault. That's what I'm calling you on.

It's a FANDOM, not an exclusive club, society or even a moral code. Look up  what the word means and check on the entry requirements. There's only one.

Don't like the more extreme elements? Fine. Have nothing to do with them. Don't like being associated with them by others? Sorry, but people you  don't know will associate and judge you on your political leanings, your religious beliefs, your race, your country of origin, your looks or anything else that marks you as Not Of The Body.

Rather than perform a tl:dr rant, I'll leave you with this to think about: have you ever ostracized or disliked a stranger based solely on one of those above factors? Like, think that guy who's a conservative/liberal sending your blood pressure upwards because of something he wrote online?

39Report (sage)
at 21 Jun 2008: 01:10

>>25
Then what do you fantasize as being? Emperor of the Universe? C'mon, demonstrate some of that imagination you say you have and tell us what +you+ want to be.

Please. The "They want to be animals, so they're abnormal deviants worthy only of disdain, while my fantasies are absolutely normal," argument never worked, so don't trot it out now.

By the way, going by many years of observation, the number of furry fans that +actually+ want to +really+ be animals is almost nil. Those sorts exist, but it's not at all the  universal trait as you would have it being.

40Report
at 21 Jun 2008: 12:31

>>38
I'm not insinuating that at all, I'm not quite sure how you're reading so far into that. Apparently analogies that aren't 100% literal are beyond you.

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